Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

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Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Surreal » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:08 pm

Recently, Mmartin put out an automatic message to all current business owners (fully owned, leased, faction-owned, etc etc) to get feedback on what script additions and changes should be prioritised to help businesses flourish on the server and function more effectively. Most of these potential changes will certainly help with businesses, but not all potential improvements for businesses are down to script changes and new coded features alone.

At present, I'm trying to tackle some of the more prominent issues surrounding businesses, their functionality and how they are interacted with by guests, Law Enforcement, criminals and how the ownership actually run them.

For example, here are a few non-script/feature issues for businesses that I have found:

Law Enforcement — Police Officers casually frequenting businesses (such as nightclubs, strip clubs, bars) just to look around or see what's going on. This, in my opinion, cripples role-play privacy for players and ruins the potential for any criminal activity or role-play to flourish inside of a business. It is unrealistic for Police Officers to queue up and frequently patrol businesses aimed at providing nightlife entertainment for no other reason than to look around or see what is going on. These people should attend the businesses when they are off-duty or not at all. Businesses are a great platform for all kinds of role-play, but not when privacy is completely suffocated by constant Police foot traffic inside of a nightclub. Some have the mentality that they have every right to walk around, demand liquor/adult/business licenses to be shown and threaten arrests on a daily basis - particularly for the newer businesses. Businesses, especially clubs, bars etc should be able to rely on their own hired security unless they wish to contact the Police. This also includes how Law Enforcement approach suspects when they are inside of an open business. Unless a pursuit led to that location, the business should not suffer by being swarmed by Police and closed due to something out of their control.

Business robberies — This mainly ties to smaller businesses like bars, diners, pawn shops, barbers, tattoo shops, and other small stores, especially in county regions that are out of the way of the main population. In some cases, it almost seems like a robbery crew will storm a bar, rob everyone inside and then brush shoulders with the next robbery crew to swarm inside the bar and do the very same. This has always been discouraged as an activity, but no official server rules have been put up about it yet. I think business robbery needs to happen with admin permission at the very least as it is extremely disruptive, immersion-breaking and in most cases: dangerous and unrealistic.

Brawls, or other violent situations — In a lot of cases, it seems the more inexperienced role-players flock to businesses that open as a means of seeking alternative entertainment, and end up starting fist-fights or brawls (usually with little-to-no role-play) inside or around businesses. This is very disruptive and irritating, and it's basically a replica of your usual Idlewood Pizza Stack brawl but taken inside a business instead. I believe there should be stricter ruling on people being able to start melee fights for little-to-no reason inside or around businesses. Brawls/violent situations that are role-played and justified, however, are obviously fine and would not fall under this ruling.

Free drinks, etc — For clubs and bars, "free drinks" seems to be a common selling point to try and drive traffic to their business when they open. I personally find this to break immersion and be wholly unrealistic. Having an unlimited supply of free drinks when visiting a bar or nightclub does not happen in real life. A small focal point, but one that I think is worth mentioning all the same. Businesses should charge for their products or services, even if it's a minor amount by asking for a couple of bucks and letting the player pay what they like. The long string of free this, that and the other is just a cheap technique to try and encourage guests at the expense of realism.

Drink driving and parking — Everyone drinks alcohol, and everyone still drives. This is one of my major gripes that I've seen with role-play stemming around businesses that serve alcohol. The penal code entry "(11)11. Driving Under The Influence (DUI)" exists for a reason but due to the sheer convenience of it, everyone drives their car to and from a business that they drink at. Realistically, a solid 85% of people would leave the business and be over the limit but I highly doubt they role-play the effects of alcohol, and would say that they are under the limit if stopped by Police. It also just leaves an absolute mess and an eye-sore outside of the business with cars littered all over the place. People should really be car-pooling, catching public transport or calling for a Taxi if they intend to drink. There's a whole lot of non-roleplay surrounding drinking and driving when it comes to attending a business opening.

Do you have any comments about the points I have made? Do you have any suggestions or complaints of your own to make? Please remember that this is a thread to address any issues with businesses that are not tied to script changes or adding new features to the server's business system. That is being addressed elsewhere.
Thanks to those of you who made my time here unforgettable. You know who you are. It was an absolute pleasure to meet different people from all over the world and spend years building and enjoying a mutual experience together. However, all good things must come to an end, and that time for me has finally come. Best wishes.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Eric » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:10 pm

I would just like to add that you should add a furniture option for businesses aswell. The interiors are getting old. It's been a forwarded suggestion for years, and hasn't been completed. Just my two cents.

ninja edit: The "Free drinks" should be banned, most unrealistic thing ever. Sure 1 time a month or something is fine but every other day is so stupid.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Surreal » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:12 pm

Eric_Chirico wrote:I would just like to add that you should add a furniture option for businesses aswell. The interiors are getting old. It's been a forwarded suggestion for years, and hasn't been completed. Just my two cents.

ninja edit: The "Free drinks" should be banned, most unrealistic thing ever. Sure 1 time a month or something is fine but every other day is so stupid.
As stated several times across my post: new features and script additions are being addressed elsewhere. I've already mentioned the idea of a furniture system for businesses, but this is not the thread to discuss that.
Thanks to those of you who made my time here unforgettable. You know who you are. It was an absolute pleasure to meet different people from all over the world and spend years building and enjoying a mutual experience together. However, all good things must come to an end, and that time for me has finally come. Best wishes.

2007 — 2019.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by NiGhTMaReXx » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:28 pm

Free drinks, etc — For clubs and bars, "free drinks" seems to be a common selling point to try and drive traffic to their business when they open. I personally find this to break immersion and be wholly unrealistic. Having an unlimited supply of free drinks when visiting a bar or nightclub does not happen in real life. A small focal point, but one that I think is worth mentioning all the same. Businesses should charge for their products or services, even if it's a minor amount by asking for a couple of bucks and letting the player pay what they like. The long string of free this, that and the other is just a cheap technique to try and encourage guests at the expense of realism.
I agree with this because it happens with every nightclub in LSRP, free drinks just being given away. How is a nightclub suppose to make incomes then if you just give free drinks away. Realistically the nightclub would be shut down by 1-2months max because they got no income.
Law Enforcement — Police Officers casually frequenting businesses (such as nightclubs, strip clubs, bars) just to look around or see what's going on. This, in my opinion, cripples role-play privacy for players and ruins the potential for any criminal activity or role-play to flourish inside of a business. It is unrealistic for Police Officers to queue up and frequently patrol businesses aimed at providing nightlife entertainment for no other reason than to look around or see what is going on. These people should attend the businesses when they are off-duty or not at all. Businesses are a great platform for all kinds of role-play, but not when privacy is completely suffocated by constant Police foot traffic inside of a nightclub. Some have the mentality that they have every right to walk around, demand liquor/adult/business licenses to be shown and threaten arrests on a daily basis - particularly for the newer businesses. Businesses, especially clubs, bars etc should be able to rely on their own hired security unless they wish to contact the Police. This also includes how Law Enforcement approach suspects when they are inside of an open business. Unless a pursuit led to that location, the business should not suffer by being swarmed by Police and closed due to something out of their control.
And this happens quite a lot, even in other buildings.
But mostly bars and nightclubs, it seems like they got nothing to do. They were never even called by an manager because someone walked inside with a gun or someone gunned down somebody then you call the cops, lately the LSPD and the SD is everywhere and you can't do any criminal activity at all gotta agree with this one aswell.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Eric » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:35 pm

Surreal wrote:
Eric_Chirico wrote:I would just like to add that you should add a furniture option for businesses aswell. The interiors are getting old. It's been a forwarded suggestion for years, and hasn't been completed. Just my two cents.

ninja edit: The "Free drinks" should be banned, most unrealistic thing ever. Sure 1 time a month or something is fine but every other day is so stupid.
As stated several times across my post: new features and script additions are being addressed elsewhere. I've already mentioned the idea of a furniture system for businesses, but this is not the thread to discuss that.
Right, my bad. Anyways, back in the days when I was apart of the team running/opening the Octopussy almost three/four nights a week regularly I think our biggest struggle was to keep the trolls out. We had people running around like mad men, jumping on the stage, spamming dumb stuff over /s etc. Hard for the business owners/managers to handle these people. I honestly think there should be a stronger punishment for people trying to ruin others RP experience like that. Really kills the mood when that happens, especially for the people spending hours trying to set up a realistic club environment. Don't know if this would help you in anyway though, but again, this is just my opinion.

I also have to agree about what you said about the LEO's walking into clubs on the regular just because they are bored. This happens way to often and I also think this kills the mood and is pretty unrealistic. Sure they can stay outside and watch the crowds if they want, but if the guards/managers need them inside then they'll call them in.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Alyssa » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:37 pm

Everything is fine, except the LEOs entering the business for some fun part!

It shouldn't matter to anyone. Either ICly get PD/SD to put policy on cops not allowed to roam in nightclubs/bars for fun OR stop bothering about it. It's totally realistic.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by .mikey » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:39 pm

An idea to help rejuvenate businesses is to give leasers the ability to move and restructure their establishment for a fixed fee, because it doesn't feel very realistic when thirty+ people have owned and managed the same diner or bar. There are businesses that are permanently tarnished because of poor roleplayers, so it doesn't feel very motivating to be grouped with them. Having your business moved to a fresh area, with a fresh name, will allow you as the leaser to get a taste of what it's actually like to own one and not being forced to work off the bad reputation other people set in stone.
Brad wrote:This just reminds me of 2013, the underground nightclub in Downtown that had the adverts for free drinks, free entry. More like free bus to the poor house. Anyone still doing this needs to take a look at basic economy. If you spend all of your money on food, and give every bit of it away? You're gonna be starving. The characters running things like bars and nightclubs are going to be looking to make money, plain and simple.
Illustrates my point perfectly. Anyone who wants to try out a business and uphold a realistic atmosphere will NOT lease "Mall Club" and be its 14th owner, especially when every generation before them offered free drinks and 100k prizes for being the best dancer.
Last edited by .mikey on Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:55 pm, edited 8 times in total.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Brad » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:43 pm

Surreal wrote:Law Enforcement — Police Officers casually frequenting businesses (such as nightclubs, strip clubs, bars) just to look around or see what's going on. This, in my opinion, cripples role-play privacy for players and ruins the potential for any criminal activity or role-play to flourish inside of a business. It is unrealistic for Police Officers to queue up and frequently patrol businesses aimed at providing nightlife entertainment for no other reason than to look around or see what is going on. These people should attend the businesses when they are off-duty or not at all. Businesses are a great platform for all kinds of role-play, but not when privacy is completely suffocated by constant Police foot traffic inside of a nightclub. Some have the mentality that they have every right to walk around, demand liquor/adult/business licenses to be shown and threaten arrests on a daily basis - particularly for the newer businesses. Businesses, especially clubs, bars etc should be able to rely on their own hired security unless they wish to contact the Police. This also includes how Law Enforcement approach suspects when they are inside of an open business. Unless a pursuit led to that location, the business should not suffer by being swarmed by Police and closed due to something out of their control.
This is something I really feel needs to be stamped out on every avenue. The concept of an on duty police officer parading into a nightclub or strip club purely because people are there is absurd. This is also commonly followed by them looking for people they know to be criminal roleplayers and demanding ID for no IC reason to initiate some form of arrest or shootout.

It needs to be put out there, and kept visible for the people in both the LSPD and the SASD that this is piss poor roleplay, realistically both of these departments would be getting sued daily for walking into nightclubs on duty and driving down business. This isn't a cops and robbers server and people in LEO factions doing dumb shit like this stops us on the other side being able to roleplay our characters appropriately because Police Officer III Piggy Ernstein and Deputy Sheriff II Dawg have decided they want to queue outside a club, flash their badges then stroll in and get a bottle of water. I won't name names but I've seen shocking roleplay from numerous members of both factions since I started roleplaying more around businesses, and on the most part it doesn't stop with the low ranking members.
Business robberies — This mainly ties to smaller businesses like bars, diners, pawn shops, barbers, tattoo shops, and other small stores, especially in county regions that are out of the way of the main population. In some cases, it almost seems like a robbery crew will storm a bar, rob everyone inside and then brush shoulders with the next robbery crew to swarm inside the bar and do the very same. This has always been discouraged as an activity, but no official server rules have been put up about it yet. I think business robbery needs to happen with admin permission at the very least as it is extremely disruptive, immersion-breaking and in most cases: dangerous and unrealistic.
Admin permission sounds like a spot on way to do this, I had to stop visiting business's on my SASD character back in the day because I'd get robbed at gunpoint within 5 minutes each time, and held hostage for some bullshit breach that would have never happened. People picture business's as an easy way to either get a quick bunch of money, or a straight up simple way to get into a high intensity shootout with either the occupants or the police.

On top of that, the concept of two gangbangers kicking it from Idlewood to Fort Carson to rob a bar with 20+ outlaw bikers or an entire crew of mobsters in Temple is hilarious.
Free drinks, etc — For clubs and bars, "free drinks" seems to be a common selling point to try and drive traffic to their business when they open. I personally find this to break immersion and be wholly unrealistic. Having an unlimited supply of free drinks when visiting a bar or nightclub does not happen in real life. A small focal point, but one that I think is worth mentioning all the same. Businesses should charge for their products or services, even if it's a minor amount by asking for a couple of bucks and letting the player pay what they like. The long string of free this, that and the other is just a cheap technique to try and encourage guests at the expense of realism.
This just reminds me of 2013, the underground nightclub in Downtown that had the adverts for free drinks, free entry. More like free bus to the poor house. Anyone still doing this needs to take a look at basic economy. If you spend all of your money on food, and give every bit of it away? You're gonna be starving. The characters running things like bars and nightclubs are going to be looking to make money, plain and simple.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Brennan. » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:55 pm

I'd like to address that in the Los Santos Police Department's Community Relationship Division, we have a Task for our Community Relations Officers to do, named 'Los Santos Night Life Presence' which is to be present outside of night clubs to provide a community focused relation for the night life and ensure a safe enviroment. We aim to not bunch officers up, but merely 1-2 officers casually stand outside and talk to people, improving community relations and so forth. What's the stance on this from Server Management?

Do keep in mind, it is highlighted that we don't infiltrate businesses negatively and CRO's are there for community relations only.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Magneto » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:56 pm

I totally agree with every aspect of your post. I'm supporting this fully.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by manna like charlie » Fri Jan 27, 2017 9:43 pm

Surreal wrote:Free drinks, etc — For clubs and bars, "free drinks" seems to be a common selling point to try and drive traffic to their business when they open. I personally find this to break immersion and be wholly unrealistic. Having an unlimited supply of free drinks when visiting a bar or nightclub does not happen in real life. A small focal point, but one that I think is worth mentioning all the same. Businesses should charge for their products or services, even if it's a minor amount by asking for a couple of bucks and letting the player pay what they like. The long string of free this, that and the other is just a cheap technique to try and encourage guests at the expense of realism.
It's absolutely fucking ridiculous to be honest with you. I'm not sure whether the majority of players have never been to a real nightclub or what, but it needs to stop in my opinion. If a nightclub round mine had a "free drinks" policy mate they'd be out of business in one night and that's not even an exaggeration. Literally every cunt would be stood at the bar like "Iya mate give us fifteen bottles of Grey Goose please." It's actually beyond a joke. Just imagine in real life it it was the case, seriously.

Commercial nightclubs irl will occasionally do offers where like if you buy a drink you'll get a free shot and shit like that, but free drinks all night? Never ever going to happen, even when you buy a booth in town you don't get free drinks all night, you get a couple of bottles of vodka and mixers that's it. LS has a completely commercial nightlife and they're the most expensive types. Everyone knows they have a proper little shit club in their area where drinks are cheap as fuck, but the commercial big ones? Nah, they're expensive as fuck for drinks and that's why everyone gets smashed before even stepping foot into them places.

Free drinks policies are aids and need to stop.

The majority of good roleplayers will avoid clubs and nightlife RP fullstop just because they know at the moment it is a cesspit of absolute dog shite RP. I'm not saying that everyone who RP's in clubs and that is wank, because that's not true, but you can't tell me you've had a realisitc roleplaying experience in one of LSRP's clubs.
Surreal wrote:Brawls, or other violent situations — In a lot of cases, it seems the more inexperienced role-players flock to businesses that open as a means of seeking alternative entertainment, and end up starting fist-fights or brawls (usually with little-to-no role-play) inside or around businesses. This is very disruptive and irritating, and it's basically a replica of your usual Idlewood Pizza Stack brawl but taken inside a business instead. I believe there should be stricter ruling on people being able to start melee fights for little-to-no reason inside or around businesses. Brawls/violent situations that are role-played and justified, however, are obviously fine and would not fall under this ruling.
I completely agree with this. In real life there's always some shit going on but I've never seen a mass fucking brawl erupt just because someone's blocking somebody else's way or something petty. OK maybe sometimes you'll see one or two people having a scrap, but it is uncommon. I think that if there was stricter ruling then the LSRP club scene would become more enjoyable and would go from a DM fest to actually having some decent RP. Obviously if the fight is justified and there is a good reason for it to take place than let it happen, but yeah if the rules are stricter on what is a justified club fight and what isn't then it would stop players just heading there to start shit with other players.
Surreal wrote:Business robberies — This mainly ties to smaller businesses like bars, diners, pawn shops, barbers, tattoo shops, and other small stores, especially in county regions that are out of the way of the main population. In some cases, it almost seems like a robbery crew will storm a bar, rob everyone inside and then brush shoulders with the next robbery crew to swarm inside the bar and do the very same. This has always been discouraged as an activity, but no official server rules have been put up about it yet. I think business robbery needs to happen with admin permission at the very least as it is extremely disruptive, immersion-breaking and in most cases: dangerous and unrealistic.
I agree that it is fucking ridiculous the amount of times a single business will be robbed when it is open, but I think it really should depend on what type of business it is whether there should be admin permissions or not, for example:

∙ Small businesses in quiet areas, such as barbers and tattoo parlours in the county/quiet areas of the city: these should not require admin permission. However if somebody wishes to rob the barbers shop in Idlewood when there's fucking multiple people stood outside then this should require admin permission, because it's a busy area of the city and it's fucking ridiculous when you know just how many police are in the area.

∙ Small restaurants/eateries (privately owned) - these shouldn't require admin permissions (provided they are in quiet areas).

∙ Chain restaurants/nightclubs/busy bars - By chain restaurants I mean the likes of Burger Shot, Cluckin Bell and Pizza Stack. These are all chain places, just like McDonald's, KFC and Burger King are in real life, and how fucking often do you hear of your local Maccies being robbed? These should all require admin permission.

Nightclubs - should require admin permission, no questions asked.

Busy bars - Now I know that bars are privately owned establishments and if it is in a quiet area and the place itself isn't busy then it shouldn't require admin permission, but if the place is busy then it should, because the amount of times places get robbed when it is busy inside without the robbers giving a single fuck is just stupid.
Last edited by manna like charlie on Fri Jan 27, 2017 9:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by James » Fri Jan 27, 2017 9:43 pm

manna like charlie wrote:
Surreal wrote:Free drinks, etc — For clubs and bars, "free drinks" seems to be a common selling point to try and drive traffic to their business when they open. I personally find this to break immersion and be wholly unrealistic. Having an unlimited supply of free drinks when visiting a bar or nightclub does not happen in real life. A small focal point, but one that I think is worth mentioning all the same. Businesses should charge for their products or services, even if it's a minor amount by asking for a couple of bucks and letting the player pay what they like. The long string of free this, that and the other is just a cheap technique to try and encourage guests at the expense of realism.
It's absolutely fucking ridiculous to be honest with you. I'm not sure whether the majority of players have never been to a real nightclub or what, but it needs to stop in my opinion. If a nightclub round mine had a "free drinks" policy mate they'd be out of business in one night and that's not even an exaggeration. Literally every cunt would be stood at the bar like "Iya mate give us fifteen bottles of Grey Goose please." It's actually beyond a joke. Just imagine in real life it it was the case, seriously.

Commercial nightclubs irl will occasionally do offers where like if you buy a drink you'll get a free shot and shit like that, but free drinks all night? Never ever going to happen, even when you buy a booth in town you don't get free drinks all night, you get a couple of bottles of vodka and mixers that's it. LS has a completely commercial nightlife and they're the most expensive types. Everyone knows they have a proper little shit club in their area where drinks are cheap as fuck, but the commercial big ones? Nah, they're expensive as fuck for drinks and that's why everyone gets smashed before even stepping foot into them places.

Free drinks policies are aids and need to stop.

The majority of good roleplayers will avoid clubs and nightlife RP fullstop just because they know at the moment it is a cesspit of absolute dog shite RP. I'm not saying that everyone who RP's in clubs and that is wank, because that's not true, but you can't tell me you've had a realisitc roleplaying experience in one of LSRP's clubs.
Surreal wrote:Brawls, or other violent situations — In a lot of cases, it seems the more inexperienced role-players flock to businesses that open as a means of seeking alternative entertainment, and end up starting fist-fights or brawls (usually with little-to-no role-play) inside or around businesses. This is very disruptive and irritating, and it's basically a replica of your usual Idlewood Pizza Stack brawl but taken inside a business instead. I believe there should be stricter ruling on people being able to start melee fights for little-to-no reason inside or around businesses. Brawls/violent situations that are role-played and justified, however, are obviously fine and would not fall under this ruling.
I completely agree with this. In real life there's always some shit going on but I've never seen a mass fucking brawl erupt just because someone's blocking somebody else's way or something petty. OK maybe sometimes you'll see one or two people having a scrap, but it is uncommon. I think that if there was stricter ruling then the LSRP club scene would become more enjoyable and would go from a DM fest to actually having some decent RP. Obviously if the fight is justified and there is a good reason for it to take place than let it happen, but yeah if the rules are stricter on what is a justified club fight and what isn't then it would stop players just heading there to start shit with other players.
Surreal wrote:Business robberies — This mainly ties to smaller businesses like bars, diners, pawn shops, barbers, tattoo shops, and other small stores, especially in county regions that are out of the way of the main population. In some cases, it almost seems like a robbery crew will storm a bar, rob everyone inside and then brush shoulders with the next robbery crew to swarm inside the bar and do the very same. This has always been discouraged as an activity, but no official server rules have been put up about it yet. I think business robbery needs to happen with admin permission at the very least as it is extremely disruptive, immersion-breaking and in most cases: dangerous and unrealistic.
I agree that it is fucking ridiculous the amount of times a single business will be robbed when it is open, but I think it really should depend on what type of business it is whether there should be admin permissions or not, for example:

- Small businesses in quiet areas, such as barbers and tattoo parlours in the county/quiet areas of the city: these should not require admin permission. However if somebody wishes to rob the barbers shop in Idlewood when there's fucking multiple people stood outside then this should require admin permission, because it's a busy area of the city and it's fucking ridiculous when you know just how many police are in the area.

- Small restaurants/eateries (privately owned) - these shouldn't require admin permissions (provided they are in quiet areas).

- Chain restaurants/nightclubs/busy bars - By chain restaurants I mean the likes of Burger Shot, Cluckin Bell and Pizza Stack. These are all chain places, just like McDonald's, KFC and Burger King are in real life, and how fucking often do you hear of your local Maccies being robbed? These should all require admin permission.

Nightclubs - should require admin permission, no questions asked.

Busy bars - Now I know that bars are privately owned establishments and if it is in a quiet area and the place itself isn't busy then it shouldn't require admin permission, but if the place is busy then it should, because the amount of times places get robbed when it is busy inside without the robbers giving a single fuck is just stupid.

Also, who drives and parks their car at a club and then continues to drive home, after drinking a bottle of Vodka?

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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Airwalk » Fri Jan 27, 2017 9:52 pm

Surreal wrote:Law Enforcement
Yes, this grinds my gears so fucking much. The most annoying part is, that they always come in the middle of an opening, rather than contacting the owners before or something. Usually I just handle it IC, as there is no particular rule against it and tell them that they have no constitutional authority to do business checkups in-character, then they usually get a Licensing Official. I personally witnessed this being done particularily by VICE Detectives against businesses ran by illegal factions just to piss them off or something and it's annoying. Apparently there is a precedent court case somewhere that was established by Laos as far as I remember and used as an IC guideline, that businesses cannot deny on duty police officers entry into the business, when it's open to the public, even if there's no emergency. That's also quite stupid if you ask me, especially that they can also just enter private areas that aren't scriptwise rooms (VIP zone, blocked off corners/booths etc). Completly breaks immersion as you already said and ruins criminal roleplay. Please do put a stop to it.
Surreal wrote:Business robberies
Admin permission, yes.
Surreal wrote:Brawls, or other violent situations
Back when I ran a nightclub on my Svetozar_Kosanovic character, I asked an admin if I was allowed to put a /motd that shootings, stabbings and bigger brawls require admin permission and he allowed me to do so. That actually helped alot and there was a shootout during only 2/10 openings (outside, not even inside anymore). Everything was kept to like 1vs1 fights, that security had easily seperated. I think shootings, stabbings and large fights should require admin permission and if the rule is ignored, harsh punishment should be issued. I had also noticed that this rule is already unofficially enforced by business owners who happen to be staff members. I'm not bashing anyone, but I and others do find this unfair to a certain extent.
Brennan. wrote:I'd like to address that in the Los Santos Police Department's Community Relationship Division, we have a Task for our Community Relations Officers to do, named 'Los Santos Night Life Presence' which is to be present outside of night clubs to provide a community focused relation for the night life and ensure a safe enviroment. We aim to not bunch officers up, but merely 1-2 officers casually stand outside and talk to people, improving community relations and so forth. What's the stance on this from Server Management?
That's perfectly fine and I encourage that, as long as it's kept outside. There's no reason a police officer should just walk into a nightclub for shits and giggles, unless there's an emergency.

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Lt Meowmers
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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Lt Meowmers » Fri Jan 27, 2017 10:01 pm

Airwalk wrote:
Surreal wrote:Law Enforcement
Yes, this grinds my gears so fucking much. The most annoying part is, that they always come in the middle of an opening, rather than contacting the owners before or something. Usually I just handle it IC, as there is no particular rule against it and tell them that they have no constitutional authority to do business checkups in-character, then they usually get a Licensing Official. I personally witnessed this being done particularily by VICE Detectives against businesses ran by illegal factions just to piss them off or something and it's annoying. Apparently there is a precedent court case somewhere that was established by Laos as far as I remember and used as an IC guideline, that businesses cannot deny on duty police officers entry into the business, when it's open to the public, even if there's no emergency. That's also quite stupid if you ask me, especially that they can also just enter private areas that aren't scriptwise rooms (VIP zone, blocked off corners/booths etc). Completly breaks immersion as you already said and ruins criminal roleplay. Please do put a stop to it.
Police aren't allowed to enter private areas. Only areas accessible to the general public.

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Airwalk
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Re: Businesses, and realistic role-play etiquette

Post by Airwalk » Fri Jan 27, 2017 10:03 pm

Spoiler: show
Subject: [16-C011] Octopussy v. Los Santos Police Department
Laos_Macen wrote:A VIP area is still public, even if it's restricted by the type of clientele. The club's employees-only area, for example, fall under the definition of exigent circumstances.

Is there any additional standing for this case?
You were saying?

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